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 Upgrading the combat system

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Jimbo Jambo




Number of posts : 24
Age : 116
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Registration date : 2007-06-30

Upgrading the combat system Empty
PostSubject: Upgrading the combat system   Upgrading the combat system EmptyWed Jun 11, 2008 1:23 am

Shokkus and I were talking a little, and we both agreed that the combat system is pretty simple (no offense, since it hasn't really been worked on much since the bot came out, so I wouldn't expect much). One of the biggest problems is the huge advantage bows have over melee weapons. They do just as much damage (or more if you buy one of those superbows), yet have over twice the range of even the longest-reaching spears (again, moreso for megabows). It's true that you can steal money with melee weapons, but that's exactly why we have banks, and money is easy enough to come by anyway. Now, realistically, getting shot in the arm with an arrow would do a lot less damage than having your limb hacked off by an axe, so different weapons should all have different damage ratings, with bows being somewhere on the bottom. Even still though, I know that most people can probably knock off at least ten shots with the most basic bow before the enemy comes anywhere near them. Even in close-combat, the who the victor is is usually more a matter of who can click the fastest rather than being the combatants' actual weapon skills.

How do you solve this? Reload times. Basically, you have to wait X number of seconds after striking before you can hit the enemy again depending on whatever weapon you're using. At first it would seem like this would really just get in the way and slow combat down, but it also leaves more room open for strategizing rather than just making combat a clickfest. It also gives an unwitting target a chance to react when they're being attacked; in real life, people would never be able to just instantly make a sword appear in their hand and start slashing you ten times a second, killing you before you could even blink, and although this doesn't totally emulate seeing a person draw a weapon, it does give you the chance to make a counter attack before you're dead.

So what'll this do? What I had in mind for this wasn't so much as balancing combat to the point where all weapons were equal, but rather to take the gigantic overall advantage from certain weapons and make each better for different situations. The reason so many different kinds of weapons have been used alongside each other over the centuries is because each is better suited to different scenarios and environments: you're not going to inconspicuously sneak into a crowd to assassinate a target by stealthfully stabbing them in the back with a ten-foot spear, nor do you want to face a front line of pikemen while wielding a heavy battle axe.

Swords
Swords are great. They're versatile, easy enough to wield, and absolutely deadly when used by someone skilled. It's no wonder why so many civilizations have used swords or sword-like weapons for so many years. I'm going to use swords as sort of my base weapon and say they have moderate stats to base the stats of the other weapons off of them.

Axes
Axes are heavy and sometimes unwieldy, but their weight gives them enormous momentum and, assuming the blade is sharp enough, they can hack through flesh and bone like their victims' bodies were comprised completely of wet noodles. Axes would have a very high damage rating, but low reload speed and a short range.

Spears
Spears are really a first-strike kind of weapon. They have a long reach and, even though they aren't bladed like swords, will still kill you sure enough if one happens to find its way into one of your vital organs. Long range and moderate to high damage, but a very low reload speed. Not suited for open combat, but you could probably switch to a sword right after dealing the first blow with a spear.

Daggers
I'd say that daggers would have a moderate to high damage rating and the highest speed, but pitiful range, like even a meter or less (a lot shorter than you'd think in AW), at least lower than axes. Now, you're probably saying, "Sure they've got a small range, but with that decent damage and low reload time, wouldn't they completely dominate other weapons at close distances?" Yes, in fact, that's the point. Daggers are small and stealthy, and are basically designed for sneak attacks (or use as sidearms I guess). You then say, "But this makes them an incredible weapon. How is the opponent supposed to react? They're dead before they even knew what hit them!" As you would be if someone stuck a real dagger in your back. How do you avoid this? Don't let your enemies get that close to you in the first place. It's common sense.... Besides, they're really only useful against stationary targets, since the speed at which AW relays other avatars' positions to you makes it nearly impossible to get very close to a moving target.

Bows
Bows come in almost as many forms as swords do, but typically they would have a very high range, lowish damage, and a low reload speed. You could probably have smaller, lighter bows with less power and range but higher speed, and heavy bows designed for sniping with high power and range but are hard to handle.

Of course the actual values of these attributes can be worked out by the bot people and can always be tweaked if it turns out one weapon is vastly superior to the others. You could also probably shift some of the values around for new weapons; nobody said we had to be limited to just these, and each of these alone comes in a variety of different forms.


Aside from reload times, quick-access item slots might be kind of neat so you can use a stored item quickly without having to type its whole name out (useful of course for items with longer names). Basically you'd type a short command (like "/slot 1" or something) to use an item you previously put into that slot. In real life, even if you're an archer, you might carry a small sidearm on you or even a sword if an enemy happens to get too close to you, and you'll likely have it in your belt or in a sheath so you don't have to ask the enemy to wait for a minute while you rummage through your pack to get it. This could also probably be used for potions so you don't have to type out that annoying drink command (don't ask me why, but I always have trouble with it) or food. It also adds the extra element of coming to combat prepared with remedies and back-up weapons. Of course the number of slots a person can have would be limited, like even just one or two.


I think the stronger weapons should have required levels on them so you can't use it unless you've actually trained with that weapon, or at least recommended levels which don't give you full stat benefits if you should fall short. This one is pretty self-explanatory, although how high a priority it is, or if it's even really that good an idea, is up to you.


Shields could do a little more than just reduce the amount of damage you take. Maybe, depending on the shield, you have a certain chance to be able to greatly soften or even completely deflect an incoming attack. There might even be a blocking skill to go with it. Some weapons might also increase the change of blocking, like swords with a parry built in. It's just that, as it is now, shields act less like shields and more like extra pieces of armor. You really shouldn't be able to use a shield with a two-handed weapon anyway, like bows or two-handed blades.


Oh, almost forgot. If you've ever played Mutation, you might remember that people's avatars made yelling and grunting noises when they were being hit. I think this might be worth putting in here just so you can actually tell when someone close to you is under attack. Either that or the bot could send nearby players console messages that Player X is attacking Player Y (it doesn't need to go into details about damage, just so long as you're made aware of a fight taking place). Or both maybe! Although the latter kind of takes away all the secrecy of killing someone in a back alley of a crowded city, it might just be easier.


Shokkus, we didn't get much of a chance to talk, so (if you actually read this whole thing) if there's something I left out or something you'd like to add, go ahead.


Last edited by Jimbo Jambo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:14 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Typos)
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dr. duke

dr. duke


Number of posts : 174
Age : 31
Localisation : Tir'an((Idaho))
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Registration date : 2007-06-05

Persona Record
Char Name: Bean Duke Turunalindi
Char Race: Elf
Char Allies: Tir'an

Upgrading the combat system Empty
PostSubject: Re: Upgrading the combat system   Upgrading the combat system EmptyThu Jun 12, 2008 12:13 am

i read this wrong sorry


Last edited by dr. duke on Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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http://www.awmyths.com
Jimbo Jambo




Number of posts : 24
Age : 116
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Registration date : 2007-06-30

Upgrading the combat system Empty
PostSubject: Re: Upgrading the combat system   Upgrading the combat system EmptyThu Jun 12, 2008 9:34 am

Blah (response to an edited post)


Last edited by Jimbo Jambo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:08 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Makes it look like I'm talking to myself....)
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Shokkus

Shokkus


Number of posts : 51
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Registration date : 2007-07-03

Persona Record
Char Name: Shokkus
Char Race: Part Elf/Part Human
Char Allies: I am Independent

Upgrading the combat system Empty
PostSubject: Re: Upgrading the combat system   Upgrading the combat system EmptyFri Jun 13, 2008 3:21 pm

Yeah, this is a suggestion area, he wasn't attacking the bot. Suggestions are always good, as can be constructive criticism.
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Goshenta




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Registration date : 2007-06-17

Upgrading the combat system Empty
PostSubject: Re: Upgrading the combat system   Upgrading the combat system EmptyFri Jun 13, 2008 3:29 pm

Thanks for your ideas, Jimbo. I'll certainly consider them for the new bot. And I agree, bows are overpowered. The majority of the bot, especially the combat system, was made in an extreme hurry barely a week before AWMyths actually opened up to the public for the first time (first time since I started working there, that is). I admit I've been lazy lately, and now I'm renewed back into AW and it's the summer! You can expect some updates coming within the next few weeks hopefully, I'm working on a new ground-up GM in which I'm taking my time (don't worry, all stats will be transferred to the new bot). I can't give away details at the moment, but this new bot will have a lot of improvements in all the systems as well as a few new features for both the bot administrators and the players in the game itself. I hope you'll be patient in waiting for this next release, as it will be worth it! Wink
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